676. How to Stop Seeking for Permission First

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Are you waiting for a green light that’s never going to come? This week, Lesley Logan dives into the "permission gap", the space between what you actually want and the action you take, often filled with self-doubt and a perceived need for validation. Whether it’s the habit of using a partner as a polite excuse to say no or constantly asking, "Does that make sense?," seeking approval is a cycle that keeps you playing small. Lesley shares how a "mean" sixth-grade teacher taught her about agency and why your language needs an audit. It’s time to stop second-guessing and start owning your choices.

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In this episode you will learn about:

  • The "badass" lesson Lesley learned from her sixth-grade teacher.
  • Understanding the permission gap and its roots in social conditioning.
  • Spotting "yellow flag" phrases that signal you are seeking approval.
  • How internalized misogyny keeps women from asserting their own agency.
  • Reclaiming power by shifting from "can't afford" to intentional choices.


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Episode Transcript:

Lesley Logan 0:00  

If you felt a lot of misogyny surrounding you, you might need to go find some really great women who can show you like you don't need to live under those rules. You don't need permission from men. You don't need anybody's permission except for your own. 


Lesley Logan 0:13  

Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.


Lesley Logan 0:56  

Hey, Be It babe. How are you? Oh my god. Welcome to our week. My solo series is going to be on permission. And this has actually come from some people on my team who were listening to the pod. It's like a permission to be, permission to become, and it made us go, like, so why do we feel like we need permission? Right? What's going on there? So this, today's episode, is going to be on like, why do we feel like we need permission? Especially for my lady listeners out there, and there's a few good men, and I think it's important that you kind of, I think you should listen to this, because I think it's important you might understand, like, why we are the way we are. It just makes you a better human, right? And then on Thursday, instead of a recap episode, it's actually going to be on, how do we stop second guessing ourselves, so that we're we're not needing to ask permission, because we're not second guessing ourselves, right? So in doing this research, I found some really great resources. And so we'll also have links to my sources in the episode show notes. But I just kind of was thinking about this place. So I remember, in the sixth grade, I had a teacher. Her name is Mrs. Scott. She had lots of plans. It was a great was a great classroom. She looked a little scary. I'm not gonna lie, like, who's older? I've been teaching for like, 40 years, by the time I got there and she said, you can't ask can I go to the bathroom with me? In fact, if you ever say can I do something, I'm going to ask you. I don't know, can you? And I remember thinking, like, what a stickler. Why is she so mean? And now, as I was researching this episode, I was like, what a fucking badass she was. Like, how cool that she was making sure that as a sixth grader, we are understanding that we could go to the bathroom on our own. We didn't need to ask permission if we could go to the bathroom, we need to ask permission to leave. Like, the question was actually like, may I go to the bathroom, is what she wanted us to understand. So like, may I do X, Y and Z, because she's like, you are completely capable of doing these things. And so it's really interesting how in our lives, especially as when we learn by looking at people's facial expressions and emotions, the sound in their voice, we're seeking out permission, right? Like, oh, is it safe to be here? Is it safe do these things? Am I safe to do this? And then because of that, it also just starts to roll into all the things that we do on a daily basis. And so we start finding ourselves, like asking permission for a lot of things. And so in the research I was doing, there are some really great anecdotal stories of people in the author's lives who used to be like their parent or role model, and then how that shifted to them asking permission as well. And I just found it really interesting how easy it is for that to become some sort of like, habit's the wrong word, but just like, maybe it's the right word, but just because part of our daily life. And you know, I used to work in retail before, as a Pilates instructor and even as a Pilates instructor I would hear this thing where people would go, mostly women, I need to ask my husband, I need to ask my partner, I need to ask my spouse. And it was interesting, because most of these people were not like housewives who had no job, and this was not their income. And by the way, like it's another conversation. But also, you know, if you are the house manager, you are allowing the person who's making that money to be able to make that money, because you're making their life so much easier. They don't have to do all these things. But that's a different story. But these are women who like brought income in as well. And so it was just really interesting to me. And I will say, whenever I say I need to ask my husband, is because I actually haven't made a decision and or I'm trying to nicely say no to you, but I don't want to say no yet, so I will say I it's a nice phrase to use, but I just remember thinking like, do they have to ask? Is this something they're asking permission for? They really love it. I remember them like loving how they looked in a purse or a necklace, like, just absolutely loving it, and then asking, like, hey, what do you think? And then that person going, I think you can look better in this. And then just, like, not getting the thing they want and getting the other thing. And I just remember going, oh, this is going to not be used, or it's going to be returned, because they really want the other thing, right? And so at any rate, why is this happening? Why are these women mostly asking for permission to be, to like, to desire, to have to own so let's get into it. 


Lesley Logan 5:08  

First, these are some questions that I thought would be fun for you to journal about, post, ponder on this week. What leads me to seek social approval before making a decision? Is it a personality trait? Could it be a lack of self-esteem, or is biology a factor? So I kind of thought that that would be fun for you to think about for your own personal thing, like, do you feel a tendency to seek approval, social approval before making a decision? Is it part of your personality? Do you think it's because you're not sure about trusting yourself, or is it is biology a factor? So there's something that's going to come up in this topic as well, and in the research, it talks about permission gap. And so permission gap is a phenomenon stemming from socialization that emphasizes the caretaking and prioritizing others' needs over personal desires. So basically, we tend to think that we need to ask if we can do something, or before we do something, seek out permission or approval because we believe or feel we should be putting other people's needs before our own needs and our own desires. And so if we're going to do something that could be something that's more for ourselves, prioritizing ourselves first, then we feel like we need permission, like, hey, can I do this thing? I'll say, just before I hit record, Brad and I were redoing the schedule, and we are recording a podcast tomorrow night, when we'd normally be at the gym. And I didn't say, hey, can I go to the gym in the morning? He normally goes to the gym with me on Wednesday nights. Didn't go, hey, can I go in the gym in the morning? I just said, hey, I'm gonna go to the gym in the morning, right? And I was like, that could be taken as rude. I can see how some people would think that is rude. But also, like, he knows that getting my Wednesday workout in is a priority for me. With a very, very busy schedule, there's no other place we can move it. And I hope he knows. I'd love for him to come. But I also know he's not gonna get up at seven in the morning. He's not gonna do it. That's what we do it on Wednesday nights. So I will say I do understand that sometimes some of the things that I say or do can sound a little rude to people on the outside. And so I can understand why sometimes we use permission as a way asking permission as a way to just like, be thoughtful. But I do think it's important to know that you're doing what you're doing, otherwise you are living in this permission gap, this phenomenon stemming from socialization that emphasizes the caretaking and prioritizing of other needs and, others' needs and over our personal desires. So maybe you don't think you need permission, that's also possible. Hopefully that's true. But I also just wanted to bring up some phrases that you might be saying or thinking that could actually be like a, like a, like a yellow flag that you're asking for permission, which is, like, have you ever said, I've always wanted to blank, like, I've always wanted to go on a trip by myself. I've always wanted to learn how to do X, Y and Z. I've always wanted to try that. I've always wanted to buy that. I've always wanted to explore this. I've always wanted to if that is something that you are pondering, then somewhere along the way, you either didn't ask or didn't feel like you had permission to do the thing, right? And sometimes it means, like you just didn't have the time or the money at the time, that that's also true. But like, if you've always wanted to go back and get a doctorate, what is stopping you? Is it social approval? Okay, then we need to look at that. You know. Is it lack of self-esteem? We need to look at that. Is it a biology factor like, or is it like, hey, lack of time and money right now? But also, is it lack of time and money because we're giving it to other people and prioritizing their needs over ours? Is it? Have you ever said I stopped myself because. I stopped myself from buying that thing, from doing that thing, I, from trying that thing, from signing up for that thing. I stopped myself because. You know, I have a lot of friends and family who, I hear them say, like, oh, I was gonna do that, but I didn't because. And it's usually because of somebody else. Someone else was coming to town, someone else was doing this. A lot of people who want to be more consistent in Pilates, but they aren't, because there's always so many things coming up. I mean, like, literally, my schedule is never the same week to week. It is not possible. So I literally had to say to the team between I don't do anything before 9:15 am and I am done with my day at 4:30 you have to fit everything into that, because I need to know that I can before 9:15 and after 4:30 I can do whatever I need to do, right? I need to know that. So it's really, really important that you're just kind of taking notice, do a little audit about what you're saying, about what you're not doing that you didn't do. Now, look, if you didn't want to do it, then don't do it. You don't even need permission from me to do that, right?


Lesley Logan 9:39  

Or do you ever feel you need someone to tell you it's going to be okay? Like, do you seek support because maybe you think your idea or how you're feeling is crazy? Are you secretly wanting someone to stop you? Like, are you asking permission because actually you are secretly wanting someone to stop you from doing it? Right? So I thought this was really funny when I was like researching for this, so I remember, I can, I can tell you where I was in LA, driving my car when the woman who taught me Pilates, her name is Julie, she's my first Pilates instructor in LA, when she taught me Pilates, I could barely afford it, so I was going every other week for a duet, and then I was doing as much as I could remember, on the mat at home, in between, and eventually I was able to afford a weekly duet, which is very was a challenge for me but I was able to do it, and I had this like inkling, I was like, I wonder, I wonder if I could learn how to teach the mat work, and then I could teach it at her studio, and that could pay for my Pilates sessions. And I remember like, being on a call with her, and she's talking about, like, buying the studio from the other owner, and she's really excited, and like, what that means. And I was like, um, you think, like, it's gonna it'd be okay if I, like, like, taught mat classes? And then she said, oh my god, Lesley, you need to become a teacher, like, but I remember needing at that time, the Lesley at that time, needed permission to become a Pilates instructor, because I honestly thought I was a little bit crazy. Part of me maybe wanted me to for them to talk to stop me, like before, I invested in something I couldn't afford, right? But, like, I definitely was asking permission to belong in the Pilates teaching community at that time, because I went to school for communications, right? So I definitely know that there's parts of my life that was, I was absolutely asking for permission, especially the younger me, especially the way, and I'll tell you, you'll see why, because I'm going to go over some primary reasons why we're asking for permission. But like, you know, obviously, the more comp you get, the more you do things, the less you feel like you need approval from others. And I do think that after 40, like, there are certain fucks that go away. And then I've heard after 50, even you have even less fucks to give. But like, hopefully, right? Hopefully, we have future versions of us that ask for less permission. But I remember that Lesley, I think that was, was in 2007 and I did my first training in 2008 so you know that how old was I then, oh my god, like 25 right? So anyways, like I remember needing needing approval and permission to make that leap. 


Lesley Logan 12:09  

So let's go into some primary reasons why, and just see which ones of these resonate with you. So societal conditioning and gender roles. From a young age, many women are taught to be nurturing and pleasing, often prioritizing family and partners over their own ambitions or needs. The social conditioning makes pursuing more feel selfish or unnatural. This for sure, I'm definitely, I'm the oldest child. I definitely took care of my siblings. I remember one of the times I got in trouble I didn't do one of the chores that I was assigned, but that chore couldn't get done unless my siblings had done their chores. And so because they hadn't done their chores, I couldn't do mine. So I did this other thing that I wanted to do. I read the book. I loved, loved to read. I got in so much trouble because, like, I should have made sure they got their chores done, right? And so just remembering these things when you're a child these different things, it's societal condition. Now, are my parents assholes? No, of course not. They're just being parents, doing the best they can, and making mistakes along the way. But it's interesting how we pick up on things like, oh, well, I better not read for myself next time, because I should be making sure they're doing what they're supposed to be doing. Okay, next example, the good woman, ideal and guilt. There's a lingering cultural narrative that suggests women should be grateful for what they have, leading to the feelings of guilt or shame when they desire more. And this is a really interesting right? Like, you can see it in lots of different things, like the time I'm recording this, you know, I watched the women's hockey team for the Olympics like win gold, and also, by the way, that women's hockey has not been in the Olympics, and since, you know, it's only been there since the 90s, and then since then, like we've medaled so much, medaled as much as the men, in a much shorter period of time, right? And when you look at how women's sports are supported, they're supported United States because of Title IX, which means that money has to be invested in women's sports if there's men's sports. And so it means that, you know, on subconscious levels, like everything that we're wanting is because of somebody else so we should be so grateful. We should be so thankful. And when women do often ask for more, they're often told, like, people label them like terrible things, like she's money hungry, or she's, you know, what is? What they call people who like climb the ladder or like and they take other they seem people as like they're taking people down, but they don't say the same thing about a man doing the same thing, right? So we we learn to be what a good woman is, and should be just grateful that we have that. Another reason why you might be asking for permission is fear of judgment. Women often fear being perceived as demanding, selfish or too much when they vocalize their desires. This stems from a culture that often judges women who step outside traditional roles. 100% I think we could all remember an example of either ourselves or someone we know who did something and somebody said something about them. Sometimes they're often compared to another woman who didn't do that thing. And it's like, well, she didn't do it, and so now they're pinning women against women. And of course, you're like, well, I guess when you compare those two, then she is too selfish. But like, is she? Is she? Do they do that with men? 


Lesley Logan 15:16  

Lack of representation. A lack of role models who are unapologetic about their desires, can make women feel that they need to wait for approval, validation or the right time, the right time. Oh, we just got to wait for the right time. You know, like, no, I don't remember anybody, any male in my life, cousins, brother, being told to, like, wait for the right time. Oh, go get it. Why don't you go get it. Why don't you go talk to them? Why don't you go put yourself out there, right? Oh, Lesley, be careful. You don't want to talk too much. Oh, you don't want to be too loud. Yeah. So this is the permission gap. So this is the space between what a woman wants and what she actually does, often filled with self-doubt and the belief that someone else needs to validate her worth. So, space between what a woman wants and what she actually does. She wants to go back to school, but she stays home to care for everybody, because asking for help or asking for people in her community to take Tuesdays and she'll take Wednesdays. Well, who? Why would she be able to do that? Who is she? Is she selfish? Right? Need for safety and responsiveness. In sexual relational context, women often need to feel safe and emotionally connected to access their desires, because they may not feel comfortable acting on their own. They may wait for a partner to initiate or create the right conditions. So this one I put in there, I just wanted to keep it because permission to be often, when you do research, you'll see that there's a lot of permission to feel worthy, permission to be able to fill their desires. Desires can be sexual, but also you could just desire to have a better life, right? Desire means a lot of different things, but I will say, if you are having any like not having to understand what you truly desire when it comes to sexual needs, please look at our episodes with Dr. Celeste Holbrook and please read her book, especially those who are raised in the church and purity culture being kind, even if your parents weren't super serious about it, there are definitely things we could talk about, and permission to feel desirable if you were at all raised around purity culture in any way. 


Lesley Logan 17:22  

All right, last one or primary reasons why you might feel like you need permission. Internalized misogyny, a patriarchal culture that often devalues female desires, can lead to women minimizing their own needs, which in turn fuels a need for external permission to assert their own agency. I think we all know some women have internalized misogyny. I can think of a bunch of women in our political government right now, and it's annoying, because, okay, well, great, you're a pick me girl, like you're in but you think they're going to care for you. You think they're going to take care of you? No. You think that when you have an idea it's going to be used? No. You're gonna have to push it through some other male, right? So, like, internalized misogyny is something that honestly can happen without your own decision, right? Because it happens because of society. It happens because of the patriarchal culture. And so unless you can get yourself out of that situation, you might not even see what you're doing. And so I highly recommend, if you have you felt a lot of misogyny surrounding you, you might need to go find some really great women who can show you like you don't need to live under those rules. You don't need permission from men. You don't need anybody's permission except for your own. But let's be real, that is harder to do. That's what we're gonna talk about, episode two, we're gonna definitely get into how to stop second guessing yourself, because just saying, okay, here's all these things. This is why it's so hard for us, this is so hard for you to not ask for permission. Doesn't mean you're just be able to ask for, like, stop asking for permission. These are habits you have. These are things you say, like, you automatically will say when something's expensive, say I can't afford that instead of saying, oh, I'm not investing in that right now, that is something I'm really, really proud of, like, how I changed my tune on that, instead of when something was more like, is more money that I have, instead of saying I can't afford that, I'm not investing in that right now, or that's more than I want to invest in that project, or that's more than I want to invest in that thing right now. All of that makes it a choice versus I'm a victim. I can't afford it right now, right? It means I'm not asking for permission to buy something. I'm asking I'm stating why I'm not buying the thing. I don't need the permission. So it takes time. So just being mindful, and I think having the awareness first and foremost, of like, the things that you're saying, the things that you're doing, just take a notice, like, maybe this week, what you're noticing is like, how often am I asking for permission, if I look good, or if this works, or if that makes sense? You know, another thing I've been working on for the last couple of years, because I heard a female CEO say this, she said, instead of saying, does that make sense? Because that's like asking permission. Did I do a good job explaining that to you? She'll say, do you have any clarifying question for me? So that way she is stating, I know I said everything you just say in the right order, in the right way, but do you have any clarifying questions that is giving them the space to ask what they need and take assertiveness, and also you're holding yourself in a space of like, I did a really great job. Oh, your questions are okay. I can see where I missed out on that. We don't need to ask permission. Does that make sense? Right? So that's something I've been really trying to work on. 


Lesley Logan 20:09  

So, all right, here are some other things, other signs that you might be asking for permission. Have you ever talked yourself out of something because someone else might not like it? You might not be liked, it'll be difficult, you have a fear of judgment, fear people will think you're crazy. Definitely, I have asked for permission in my past because I do a lot of weird, crazy stuff, and I'm like, I'm recognizing that, and now people just know I'm a little crazy, so that's fine, but it takes some time to get your confidence up, right? That like it's okay to be crazy. Have you ever talked yourself out of doing something because someone in your life wouldn't approve? You're afraid to look silly. You won't belong. You'll upset someone. The cost, you don't feel worthy. They might say no, so you're saying no first, and then you don't want to fail, right? Fear of failure. Then it sounds like you're in a state where you feel you need permission, and you're in that permission gap. So how do we close it? Well, I think first of all, awareness is important. I think we can't close any gap without actually noticing, like, where is this permission habit coming from? Who do we learn it from? Who do we observe it from? Not to go blame them, but just so you can, kind of, like, take the control back and realize what's going on and just notice that when you're doing it, and also those dear, amazing friends that you have, like, perhaps we need to, like, say, hey, here's what I noticed about myself. I notice that I ask like, what do you think? Instead of asking, like, tell me what your excited thoughts are, and then maybe what are some concerns you have? Like, that would be fine, because now you're asking them to, like, point out pros and cons. But just like, what do you think? Especially because a lot of us as people who never think anything good will happen to us, you know, we have those family members. We've had so many guests on the on the Be It Pod, talk about like, make sure that you're aware of who you're telling your ideas to, right? Because if you're telling your amazing ideas to people who will never believe in something possible, you're going to be, basically asking permission from people who are never going to give it. Just want you to notice what your habits are, what parts of you are feeling that permission need. Yeah, and then on Thursday, we're going to talk about how to close that gap, how to trust yourself, how to give yourself permission. That will be our episode on Thursday. So I'd love to hear how you're liking these topics. If you have topics that you're wanting me to address, you can actually send it into the beitpod.com/questions to say, hey, episode topic, and we'll put in the lineup. We're still gonna have the interviews, we're still gonna have the recaps, but we thought it'd be fun to basically, in between some of these interviews, do some of these solo episodes on some topics that maybe we could just dive a little bit deeper, that sometimes it doesn't happen in an interview because the conversation goes a different way. So thank you so much. And until next time, Be It Till You See It.


Lesley Logan 22:57  

That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.


Brad Crowell 23:40  

It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.


Lesley Logan 23:45  

It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.


Brad Crowell 23:49  

Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.


Lesley Logan 23:56  

Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.


Brad Crowell 24:00  

Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.


Lesley Logan 24:13  

So internalized misogyny, a patriarchal cultural, a patriarchal. What a shitty word. I can't even say it. A patriarchal culture that often values. Oh my lord on high. What bloopers? Let's keep them in at the end.



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