526. Why Your Brand Energy Matters More Than a Logo

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Brand strategist and second time guest, Hilary Hartling returns with fresh insights on building magnetic brands that reflect who you are and speak to who you serve. In this powerful conversation, she and Lesley Logan talk about how energy, clarity, and authenticity are at the heart of every great brand. Hilary also shares tips for avoiding branding ruts, using AI without losing your voice, and why consistency is more important than perfection.

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In this episode you will learn about:

  • Why brand energy creates stronger emotional connection.
  • How to use and integrate AI to amplify your voice.
  • Why consistency is the true magic behind standout brands.
  • Why figuring out your “why” matters more than your process.
  • How to identify and attract your ideal client with clarity.
  • A powerful tool for reconnecting with your purpose and message.
  • Why launching with clarity leads to faster, more aligned sales. 


Episode References/Links:


Guest Bio:

Hilary Hartling is a Brand & Messaging Strategist who helps entrepreneurs build captivating, heart-led brands that deeply resonate with their audience. With over 15 years of experience as Vice President of Integrated Marketing & Synergy for powerhouse film brands like Disney, Pixar, and Marvel, Hilary now brings that blockbuster-level strategy to mission-driven business owners. Through her signature programs and intuitive approach, she helps clients translate their vision into messaging that feels authentic, aligned, and magnetic. Whether through one-on-one consulting or her Brand Polish Academy, Hilary empowers creatives and coaches to articulate their unique value, attract right-fit clients, and show up consistently with confidence and clarity. Her work is rooted in both strategy and soul—because when your brand reflects your truth, success becomes inevitable.

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Episode Transcript:

Hilary Hartling 0:00  

What you think about your brand and what you believe in for your brand is what your audience is going to reflect back to you. So that's why it's good to define the kind of brand you want to share, what do you want it to be known for, and then really understand how to mirror your audience.


Lesley Logan 0:16  

Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.


Lesley Logan 0:59  

Okay, Be It babe. This, this is the podcast for your business that you always needed. So I know a lot of you are trying to start a thing. You have a thing and you get stuck. You get stuck, you get in your own way. And my guest today, the reason why I freaking love her is that she is brilliant beyond brilliant when it comes to the strategies and ways to communicate who you are and what you do, but she also has this equal way of being energetic and like who you are and affirmative and meditative. And so I really love her, because sometimes I feel like the business world can just feel extremely masculine, and it's a lot of like, do, do, do, do, do, and just like, spit this out and do this thing. And she is very much like, what's on your heart and who's, what's on their heart, and how do we actually connect those? So she is the one and only Hilary Hartling. She is amazing. If you've been listening to podcasts for over three years, you heard an episode from her already. I promise you, this is another amazing episode. So even if this is the second time you're listening to her, you, your mind will be blown. I adore her and you're gonna want to do the meditation that she has. I totally know it. I'm downloading it. So here she is, Hilary Hartling. 


Lesley Logan 2:15  

All right, Be It babe. It's been a while since we've had today's epic guest, but I honestly look for any time that I can be in this woman's amazing spaces, because she's wonderful. She's amazing. She is a rock star in so many ways, and she's gonna blow your mind when it comes to branding. So Hilary Hartling, can you tell everyone who you are and what you rock at?


Hilary Hartling 2:36  

Oh my gosh. What a welcome. Thank you, Lesley. And yes, I'm happy to be on Be It Till You See It again, but I'm a brand and messaging strategist for the modern entrepreneur, everyone who is mission-driven, passion-fueled, and is excited about attracting the right fit clients to their business with the right positioning, messaging and offers. So that's what I do for entrepreneurs. 


Lesley Logan 3:00  

Yeah and you do it so well, and you do it in a way that doesn't feel like cookie-cutter or not authentic. Like, I think when people think branding, you know, we talked about this the last time you were on, they think colors, logo.


Hilary Hartling 3:13  

It's true a lot of times. People, well, people just aren't, they don't have to know everything about marketing and branding, right? Like, that's why, you know, I exist as a branding expert. It's like they don't, they need to be educated about what's included, what's involved in branding your business, and the most out there thing for people to see first might be a logo, might be colors, or might even be like a tagline, right? So, but there's so much more that goes into it, and I do, I try to really infuse, find out from each individual business owner, whether it be like I'm doing a group program with my course, or I'm doing one on one, I always want to find out what the vision is for that business owner so we can translate that into a unique brand for them. Even if I'm working with a ton of photographers, right? They're all photographers. They're all going to have a very individual, unique brand, because that's the point of creating a brand. So it stands out.


Lesley Logan 4:07  

Yeah. And I think like, like when I think about being it till you see it, I feel like, the way you talk about branding, the way that you see it, it's almost, it is almost be it till you see it with your brand, because you're kind of figuring out, like, how do I want people to feel? How do I want them to, to, what do I want their experience to be, and the business that I'm creating that they haven't yet had, yet? 


Hilary Hartling 4:33  

Yeah, I feel like my whole business as a brand and messaging strategist is I'm helping these business owners, be it, their brands be it so that they can articulate their most authentic selves, step into their personal power, build a brand that really, truly resonates with their ideal audience. So and it comes from my belief, too, that I think every brand has an energy to it, and every business owner has an energy. And that is what radiates out when you focus on harnessing that energy. That's when you captivate your audience. 


Lesley Logan 5:06  

Yeah. And I so, okay, before we get like, ahead of ourselves, how did you get into this? In case people haven't listened like, I don't know, my God, three years ago, let's remind everyone your amazing journey. 


Hilary Hartling 5:18  

Yeah. I mean, I really started my, the bulk of my career in corporate for a Fortune 50 company that a lot of people have heard of. It was at Disney. I worked for 15 years at Disney as an integrated marketing and synergy executive, but within that role, everything in my role at Disney sort of led me to what I'm doing now for entrepreneurs, it's really this idea of understanding a brand and what it takes to not only be consistent, but to continually inspire your audience, create fans, and keep them coming back for more. So anything that you could learn from like the Disney brand, you can apply that to your own small business. That's what's really cool. 


Lesley Logan 5:58  

I mean, I think it's so true, because it's like, first of all, you know, getting the first customer is the hardest part. Like, getting someone to trust you enough to spend dollars with you is so difficult, but then you've got to also keep them coming back for more. And sometimes people get so obsessed with just continue to get new customers versus, like, inspire their current clients to still participate in the brand. I want to go into the energy a bit more, because I feel like people don't think of it like that. They think this is my business. These are my goals. This is what I'm here to do. And they don't take in to account their energy. And so how did you figure that out? What was that experience like when you discovered it's an energy? 


Hilary Hartling 6:41  

Yeah, I mean, I've always been into energy, so there's that. But honestly, like, I call it the reciprocal energy flow, right? It's like the energy you put out is what you get back, and that leads to all the things, right? What you think about your brand, and what you believe in for your brand is what your audience is going to reflect back to you. So that's why it's good to define the kind of brand you want to share, what do you want it to be known for, and then really understand how to mirror your audience, right, so that you are understanding what they need, and you're meeting them where they're at, but that you don't, as a business owner, because sometimes, you know, it's up, up and down with, with businesses and entrepreneurship. We know this, but when you find yourself in that rut, how do you pull yourself out of it? Because that rut can lead to more rut if your negative energy is being put out there. So it's, it's like energy, to me, is everything, because energy is the feeling. Energy is the experience. You can't captivate or enchant or delight your audience unless you know what's going to make them perk up and pay attention, what's going to hit them in their heart center, right? Like, really tugging on those heartstrings. Like, if you watch Super Bowl commercials, like, I wasn't actually overly impressed this year, but.


Lesley Logan 7:59  

I skipped them. I figured the best ones would come forward. 


Hilary Hartling 8:02  

The one, the ones that always get me is like the Clydesdales for Budweiser. And this year, it was like this little baby Clydesdale who was jealous of like the big, full grown ones who got to carry the cart with all of the Budweiser kegs. But there was a keg that fell off the back, and he's like, I'm gonna do it. And he jumped the fence and he rolled that sucker all the way to the destination. Was like, I did it. And it was like, it's just so cute and so fun. But anyways, anything that could tug on your heartstrings, that's an energy. You're deciding the energy you want to create with your brand, with your audience, and it's the energy that's going to pull people in, right? That's what's becoming magnetic for your audience. It's all about the energy. Like, like, I think everything is, but you won't find yourself in your flow unless you've decided to define what you want that energy to be for your brands. 


Lesley Logan 8:54  

Yes and I love you highlighted, like, if you're in a rut, and that's energy you're putting out there, that's not really, that's just going to lead to more ruts, because, like, the attraction, how many of the clients do you really want that are also attracted to a rut?


Hilary Hartling 9:09  

Like, if you're going around saying every single day, like, well, this just isn't working for me, right? Well, then you're going to attract people who doesn't think your service works for them, and so they're not going to buy it.


Lesley Logan 9:18  

Right and then, and then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, because that's what you're surrounding with. 


Hilary Hartling 9:23  

Yes. 


Lesley Logan 9:24  

Oh my God, this is, I'm obsessed. Okay, so first of all, I think the other thing that I want to highlight what you said is like the energy that they want to feel, what's going to tug on their heartstrings, I find a lot of people, as they're trying to create what they want to be their brand, or maybe they're in it, I find they get really stuck on, what do the people want? What do the people need? I actually think that they know. I think deep down, they know. I think they're a little scared to admit it, because then what if they're wrong? Or, like, what if they now that they know, what do they do with this information? But how do we figure out, like, what's pulling on the heartstrings? Is it like a series of questions we ask, is it something about ourselves? Is it what our brand is doing? Because most people, they focus on here's my process. You book this call, then I do this with you, and then you buy this thing, and it's like that, that's great. You need a journey. But that's not what people are buying. They don't want the journey.


Hilary Hartling 10:13  

That's, I mean, it's, it's really, it is what Simon Sinek says. People don't buy what you do. They buy why you do it. The why becomes your brand story. The why becomes the why of your clients, too. It's focusing on, I've said this so many times with you and your audience, right? It's focusing on the benefits first, right? Not just the features or the process. That'll come, but the benefits, that's the thing that's like, what do you really, really want, right? And I I've done this comparison before, like, when I think back to my Disney days, I remember walking into these huge marketing meetings to kick off a new film that we're going to be working on. It's usually like a year out from release. And I remember, like, here's one example. We had the slew of sports movies for a long time. You know, Remember the Titans, and Miracle, and we walk into the one about The Rookie, which is Dennis Quaid, and he's the oldest baseball player to make the majors, and we sit down at the table, and it's a big joke at this time, because we've done so many movies, and they're like, okay, it's not a baseball movie. I'm like, okay, right? It's not. We have to remember this. It's not a baseball movie, no, it's a movie about second chances and never giving up on your dreams. Okay? It's not about the thing. It's about why people would care. Okay, that's what you need to focus on for your branding.


Lesley Logan 11:35  

Yeah, I love this. It's almost like you can't use what you do as part of the definition. 


Hilary Hartling 11:40  

Right. That gets you, that gets you so far is like you have to be clear in your branding, right? A super big believer, and you need to clearly state what you do and who it's for, but that's just a positioning. That's not the inspirational part, that's not the why, that's not the what they take away from it. You have to think about the whole idea of what is keeping your ideal client up at night that they're so worried about that they're not getting right with that thing you can help with, and go from there. And a lot of times it does, it does help to start from a pain point, because if you just tell them the beautiful, amazing end result, they're not going to believe it, unless you relate with them on why they're struggling right now.


Lesley Logan 12:20  

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that means you have to be vulnerable. 


Hilary Hartling 12:25  

Yes, yes. You know, there's, there's something, you know, I'm in the midst right now, I'm updating and evolving my course called Brand Polish Academy, and one thing I'm going to add that I'm very excited about is some AI prompts for people, because once you know your brand strategy, you can put that into chatGPT and it can spit you out so many amazing ideas for your brand. You have to make sure they're in your voice. You don't want to take anything just as it comes out as it spits out, but you can figure out so much once you know your brand strategy, you can plug that in to say, I'm training you to be my brand voice and my messaging and understanding my ideal clients. And I know these are their pain points, so keep all of that in mind when you tell me X, Y or Z, right? 


Lesley Logan 13:12  

Yes. I mean, I love that you're going to add that in because it is such a thing. My team has actually built the Lesley bot, which is like, it's trained on 10 million of my words. So, like, people can literally ask, ask at any Pilates business question. It literally it's, first of all, she's uplifting. She validates you, she repeats what you said, she points out what's really great. And then she gives you things, and then questions. And people are like, I don't want to use it. And I'm like, I'm going to tell you right now. I'm amazed at what she is putting out. She spits out way more than I can. I couldn't do it as fast as she can, you know, and she's trained on me, so it's all my stuff. But also they've used, you know, the chatGPT and things that are out there to be like, okay, here's some written work by her. Here is who we're talking to. Here's what this is. And now we need to tell people about X, Y and Z, and then doing it. Like, first of all, I had some, some things like, like I didn't even tell them we're doing this because they heard me one time say, I'm never going to let you do that. I love to write, because I do. I love to write, but I will say they finally showed it to me, and it's kind of amazing, because it gets out sometimes we get in our own head, and especially talk about the rut and the energy. If your energy is nervous or scared or this has to work, and if it doesn't work, I'm like, my business is failing. That energy is not going to help you write and tug on the heartstring. It's actually in the way. And so you almost need to use.


Hilary Hartling 14:30  

The extra help, a little helping hand. I agree. And by the way, let's back up a second, everything you just said that you preface like, you know it knows this about me and this about, all of that that you just said, that it knows that you had to put in there to explain, to create this bot, that's your brand strategy. That's part of your brand strategy. It's knowing enough about your brand to be able to explain it to someone, whether it's an AI tool or it's someone you're hiring for your business, or it's someone on your team, it's the only way you can create and present a consistent brand. And honestly, consistency is one of the pieces that creates the magic for your brand, because I promise you, not everybody out there is being consistent. And when you can be, you show up for people in a whole new light. 


Lesley Logan 15:16  

Yes, yes. And I mean, consistency is so hard in general, let's just take your branding out of it, just being consistent with your morning routines or consistent in your life, it's not easy, but it is actually proven that when you are consistent with anything, you actually get what you want out of it. 


Hilary Hartling 15:32  

It's so true. I don't know why it's so hard. It just is. I mean, even with the Pilates practice, right? 


Lesley Logan 15:37  

Yeah. Oh yeah. I mean, people are like, I'm gonna come once a week, I'm like, that, that's great. You can never miss, and if you never miss, that is consistent. But, you know, more would be better. You know, like that would be consistent. But I think, like, people have a hard time with that. And so if people do what you say, and they're, and they're focused on the energy, and they're pulling the heartstrings, and they're being consistent, what is a reasonable timeline for them to know if it's working, what are the KPIs that they're using? Because it can't, to me, it can't be vanity metrics all the time. It can't just be like, oh, I got this many likes. Because if you're new to getting followers, you're not going to get a million likes on things like, you're just no, no one's going viral like that anymore, you know, unless it's like some dog video that's, you know, pushing, like, you know. So how do you do that because that, you got to keep the energy up and the belief up. So what do you think? 


Hilary Hartling 16:24  

I mean, honestly, the biggest KPI is, are you booking clients? I mean, that's the biggest one, right? But also, you can look at things like, if you're creating a funnel, right, and you're introducing or inviting people into your brand, what's that first stop? What's that entry level thing? What's that free resource or lead magnet or low ticket offer. Are people buying that because you showing up saying, hey, I know you need this right now. So let me tell you how to do that for either this, only this much money, teeny bit, or let me give this to you for free, because I know this is on your mind right now. And if I relax your mind and you can make your shoulders go down about this whole topic, and you get some quick wins because I gave you this thing, then you're going to be more apt to come and find out more from me, from that brand, right? And so I think that is a very good tool, like, if your freebie is flying off the shelf, right? Whatever it might be off the digital shelf, even, then, that's a very good indicator. Now, there might be other things to tweak along the way, if then that's not converting into clients, but you always have the opportunity to, I think, first connect with your audience on a level that they care about. Because here's the other thing, you are the expert in what you do, right? But you could get caught up in your expertise and not necessarily say it the way your ideal client is going to understand right now, right? A lot of my ideal clients, they don't know that brand strategy is the solution. They don't even know that, right? And so you have to speak to them in the way they're talking about it, saying, like, gosh, I feel like my messaging is all over the place, or I don't really know how to talk about my business in a way that the right people get it. Like, what do I do about that? So some might think I need to hire a copywriter that could be a solve but a lot of times, people just haven't figured out the base foundation, solid brand strategy that leads to all the aligned messaging, aligned offers positioning that makes you stand out. And so it's a lot of education on my part too, right? It's like people just like we started at the beginning, people sometimes just think it's colors and logo. And it is not.


Lesley Logan 18:38  

Yeah. I appreciate you bringing, remind us like you have to know your business so well that you are an expert at what you do, or at least for who you help, you know, and you have to treat yourself as such, but also then you have to talk to people who aren't, not understanding that expertise. And it's really, really hard. An example is like a lot of Pilates teachers that I work with, they're like, I just want to teach advanced clients. I want to teach athletes, because they don'tknow how to move their body. And I'm like, so the journey of the people you'll work with don't know how to move their body, and so you can do that. And if you have connections to the NFL or the NBA in your town, by all means, go right ahead. They all need someone. But the reality is, is the most of us have to teach the public and the public in your area. And so there are people in your area who could become an advanced mover who don't know how to move their body yet. And so you cannot talk to them like people who move their body because they don't know that. They don't know that that's a solution to their problem. They don't that's the thing that's going to make them feel good. They don't know that that's the thing that will make them feel confident. And so people do talk in the wrong way, and then they go, no one's listening. And. 


Hilary Hartling 19:43  

Yeah, I have a funny double-edged sword with my brand, where people love the fact that I have worked for Disney, and that grounds me as an expert in what I do, because I worked for a brand like that, but then that can also lead people to think, well, I can't approach her. Right? And so a lot about my brand is being very friendly and approachable and welcoming and inviting to see like I just did this, just a one week freebie last week, where I offered my list, and I think I did it maybe on Instagram, too. I said, just for a week, submit a question. I'm going to record a video response, just one branding question that you would like an answer to, and I will do a video response for you. And so I was recording video responses all week long. And people are like, how are you giving this away for free? I'm like, well, number one, it shows me exactly what my audience is thinking. So back to your point of like, how do you tug their heartstrings? It's knowing where they're at right now. And so every once in a while, getting in touch and doing a temperature check and asking, what's the thing that you would really like some help with right now? And all the questions were so, so different. 


Lesley Logan 20:51  

Yeah. Also, brilliant everyone. You should steal that as a thing you can do is, you know, be like a freak you because you do find out what are they thinking about. You know.  


Hilary Hartling 21:02  

Yeah. That was my whole point. It's like market research, but also it's me connecting with my audience, too. Yeah. So when you stay in touch and you actually form these real relationships, maybe they're not going to book your service right now, but they're going to remember that, and they're going to come back when they really, really need your help.


Lesley Logan 21:19  

Yeah and that's the other hard part, right, of being a brand that is consistent, it's you have to be consistent, you have to make sure that they understand what you're there for, and stay top of mind, so when they're ready to pull the trigger they remember you.


Hilary Hartling 21:33  

Yeah. I mean, there are also other tactics, right? You can try to make them see that they need it now versus later. There's other things to do, but still, like, you still might get the, oh, this has been so fantastic. Let me go off and try this, or let me do this and I'll come back, you know, when I'm ready, or if I need, you know. So you'll never know where someone's at, but, and I've had people who I had a call with, you know, six months prior, and they come back and they're like, boom, I'm ready. Here's my money. Let's go. This is the time, right? Like, you just never know.


Lesley Logan 22:04  

Yeah, no, it's very true. And I think, like, thank you for sharing that, because we've had the same thing. You know, I worked in retail. I worked in high end accessories, and so of course, there'd be the people who came up, and obviously we made sales throughout the day that would be affordable prices on like, you know, $50 gifts, $100 gifts, like, that kind of a thing. But, you know, we really had to sell like, a $2,000 ring every once in a while, ideally every week. And there'll be people who will just come in and go, can I try that on? Oh, my God, I love this. And I would be like, oh, have you seen it before, because they're like about to buy, like, no, it's first time and I just really love it. And they'll just buy it. And there's other people who come and look at it for six months, and they're looking at it and they're putting it on, okay, and my birthday is in six months, and then they come back and they get it. And so it's like everyone is a little bit different, even in a brand that you're trying to attract. And so, you know, the patience that it takes, but also the belief in what you do. Do you have tools that you use to remind yourself why you do what you do? You know what I mean? Because, I'm like, people doesn't even like getting ruts and like, there are bad days. There's days where I'm like, is anyone listening, even though I have tons of evidence that we're doing a great job. There's just some days where you're just, I'm just getting hit over the head and getting a lot of rejection, so. 


Hilary Hartling 23:14  

Well, that's just human, that's just human, and that's just the cyclical nature of business as well. But I think for me, it's always coming back to trusting my intuition and trusting myself, right, which is hard for some people, right? And it's, it's keeping the belief so, whether it be brand affirmations, right, just like you might do abundance affirmations or anything, it's, it's talking to yourself, in a way, and especially if you're having those negative thoughts, it's just like pulling those negative thoughts to the forefront, noticing them and reframing them so that you're not like stopping your energy flow like we were talking about earlier. But I always use intuition as sort of my own compass, and I think when you give yourself room and space to just listen, because there's so many times, especially with branding, where you're looking externally for the answers in terms of, I'm looking at this brand, of this competitor in my industry, and oh my gosh, why can't I come across that way? Or you're just looking for answers elsewhere, when a lot of times, if you just ask and you receive the guidance internally, in fact, you know what I just, I just created this week that your audience might love, is I created, for the first time, a meditation for my audience. It's a brand vision guided meditation. 


Lesley Logan 24:32  

Yes, we're in, we want. 


Hilary Hartling 24:34  

Yeah, anytime, so it's whether you're starting from scratch or you're an established business. It helps you with clarity. It helps you kind of step away from overthinking about your brand, so you're coming out of your head and into your heart, which is what we want from your brand, we want to be in the heart space, it helps you, like, envision the essence of your brand, how it feels, who it attracts, what makes it unique. But also, like giving you some clarity on your deeper purpose and that message you want to share. So I go through all seven chakras for your brand. In the meditation. It's a 20 minute meditation, and you just come away with whatever downloads you get. But you can do it as many times as you want, right? You might get something new every time. 


Lesley Logan 25:17  

Oh, my God, we must link this. And this is amazing. Yes, I want that. And then also, I mean, I feel you need to do some brand affirmation cards. Like, I feel like you needed anything like a deck in you.


Hilary Hartling 25:28  

Yeah, well, you know what's funny is I used to do it when I like, I've gone back and forth on how I've done my online course. Sometimes I run it as a group program. And when I do that, I would put these brand affirmations. It's just like posts in our community Facebook group all the time. So I'm like, I should aggregate all those, because it's, it is, it's very helpful. And then it even, like clues you into a little bit of what you could focus on today for your brand kind of thing. 


Lesley Logan 25:52  

Yes, I love that. I mean, my goodness, that could be its own lead magnet, or you could actually sell them as a deck you could draw. And it's like, this is what, you know, I just, I like a deck of any kind. 


Hilary Hartling 26:02  

I do too. 


Lesley Logan 26:03  

I just find them to be so fun. I don't even know what half the things mean. Currently, I drew a card from a deck, and it's a porcupine with lightning bolts and stars. And I'm like, unclear what I'm supposed to get from that, but I'm just gonna say you can, like, it have little things that can prick people, and you can be magical at the same time. I don't know what that card means, but, like.


Hilary Hartling 26:20  

Well, I would immediately look up the spiritual meaning of a porcupine. 


Lesley Logan 26:23  

Okay, well, thank you for that tip. Yeah. It takes, as you, we've mentioned a couple times, it's the constant belief in yourself. You almost have to have a good healthy dose of narcissism, if there could be any kind of healthy narcissism, to remember that you're amazing. And since we are, most of us who are listening to this are not narcissists, you wouldn't be being it until you see it if you just think you are. So congratulations, you're not, if you're listening to this. But I think having some sort of reminder of who you are, why you do it, what you do, like we need those things for those bad days. 


Hilary Hartling 26:56  

We do. We do. It's amazing because I even remember back to my first brand clarity in-person workshop that I did. And I I just found the workbook the other day, and I opened it up, and the first page, I actually put the song, I Believe, from The Wiz, which was the song that my theater company would sing every night before we went on to perform so that I believe in you, right? That's the main message of the whole song. But, like, it's a whole thing. But I put all the lyrics in there because I was like, this is so true. If you don't believe in your brand, why would someone else? Why would someone else? And you're putting your brand out into the world, and you're not like, asking people to love it, you're serving people. You're saying, I have this knowledge or expertise or product, whatever kind of business you have, and I know this helps you do this. It's worked for me. It's worked so for so many others. It can help you, too. If this is what you're struggling with, here it is, right? You never think about if you're in the grocery store. You don't yell at the grocery store because they're trying to upsell you at checkout with gum and candy. You're like, I might want some today, okay. Right? People sell to you all the time. You're on tons of email lists you don't even realize because you wanted the 20% off. Right? Like, it's, it's all sales. It's all business. People are used to that. People are used to you asking, people asking for the sale, because they would never imagine that if they expect value in return, that they wouldn't give you that reciprocal energy back, right? 


Lesley Logan 28:37  

Yeah, I love that. You pointed out we don't get the grocery store. We just, like, we end up buying the stuff half the time. You know, we're and one of my old coaches, she was joking, she did this little, like, fitness challenge, and there was an add on that you could, like, it's called the bump everyone. There's a bump of the cart that you could add that on. And then they got to check out. I was like, well, here's a one time offer. And so she's like, okay, I'm gonna add that to cart. And then it's like, oh, well, if you got this, here's this other one time offer. And she got that, and at the end, she's like, I just want to pay like, I went from a $17 thing to paying you $217. I still wasn't angry about it. She was laughing. Because the reality is is, if you know exactly what your client wants, then first of all, you get to sell it to them, and you're not a manipulative asshole, because what you're giving them is what they wanted. It's going to solve the problem that they have, and you are the expert who can do that, and they get what they need. Otherwise someone else is going to sell them something shitty that you know because they didn't hear about you. They didn't hear that you existed. They don't hear what you have. And so you kind of owe it to them to not let the competitor who's not as good as you getting into their headspace. 


Hilary Hartling 29:43  

That's so right, and that's where consistency comes into right? It's like your competitor might be, you know, 10 steps behind you, but they're selling out because they're showing up. So don't let the lack of that, I've been seeing all these Instagram accounts lately for like the introvert business, where you don't show your face, right? So it's all these Instagram feed posts where it's just like the backs of people's heads and or just like quotes and things, and that is like going gangbusters for whatever reason. I'm sure they're tapping into heartstrings all over the place, right? But it's just so interesting, because here's the thing, there's so many ways to do it. What you have to start with every time is understanding your business, your brand, so that no matter what strategy you want to employ for marketing or copywriting or website design, whatever it is, that it still feels like your brand for your audience, yeah.  


Lesley Logan 30:37  

And I think that's so key, like one of the things when we coach Pilates instructors, we're like, okay, who are you helping? Why do you want to help these people? How do you help them? I mean, there are people who don't sign up for our program because they can't get past that question. I just need more clients. I'm like, I'm going to tell you right now, there are 17 clients outside for you. You could get probably half of them if you can articulate how you can help them so you don't even have to care about it. You could just, if you could just articulate how you can help them, if that's how they want to be helped, they'll buy from you. You're holding yourself back by getting stuck and making it complicated. And it is complicated, but also, I think it's about being honest with ourselves. Why am I doing this? And you know, and I think some people might even feel maybe it's not enough to just want to help those people. Like, I feel like there's this pressure that we're all putting on these brands, and so we don't get these ideas off. I wanted to have you on, because I know we have so many listeners who are business owners or want to be business owners, and they do not get their business to the next step. Year after year, they're stuck in the same place because they won't just sit and answer those questions about that you've talked about in different ways that will help them identify so that they can be consistent. 


Hilary Hartling 31:45  

Yeah. And the thing is, too is, like, it doesn't have to be perfect. I say this a lot too. It's like, don't wait for perfection, because it can't be perfect unless you put it out there to get feedback from your actual ideal clients, right? You can't tweak it unless, like, you've seen what resonates with them most. So you can't be scared to start either like it doesn't have to be perfect to start. You just have to be able to articulate some things about your business, what you do, who it's for, the benefit that they can take away from working with you, and maybe how you're different from other people in your industry. 


Lesley Logan 32:19  

Yeah, I love that, because also, I find when people ask me what Pilates is I have a succinct answer, and I have teachers going, oh my God, I just love the way you describe it. I'm like, do you think that's how it came up the first time? No, it didn't. It was like, a fucking paragraph. And I was like, well, I gotta shorten that. You watch people's eyes glaze over, or, like, they start to look around the room, and you're like, I've lost them. That's, you know, I've got to figure out, like, how do I succinctly say who it is what I do and how I do it, so that if this person is interested, they stick around, and if they're not, neither of us are wasting our time. But to your point, you got to get something out there and try it out and say it out loud and get the feedback. Where people go, oh, it's like yoga, and it's like, oh, okay, I didn't explain it very well, because I explained it like yoga, so like that, you know. 


Hilary Hartling 32:59  

Yeah, then you can perfect, that's, that's where the perfecting, meaning, the tweaking comes in, so that they understand even so you're more clear, and you can then make it more compelling for them as well.


Lesley Logan 33:11  

Okay, so I love you, and I just, I, you make, I mean, we've done so much greatness, because you make you want to, like, dig into my branding all the time. I'm just like, okay, let me. 


Hilary Hartling 33:20  

It's so fun. 


Lesley Logan 33:21  

Yeah, it's just really fun. What are you most excited about right now? Do you ever wonder, like, has everyone figured out branding? Are you? So what are you most excited about right now? And you say that the world needs you more than ever. What's going on the branding world? 


Hilary Hartling 33:32  

I do think it's been shown over the last few years how valuable it is to not just run a business, but to build a brand, because it's brands that people fall in love with, follow, want to keep coming back to, and that's what you want to have a long lasting business. It means that you've articulated what you care about. Maybe there's shared values involved. People today really care about who they're buying from and consuming from, and so they want to know that you're someone that they trust and that you have some of the same beliefs or hopes or dreams. It matters, and your brand strategy expresses that about your brand. I just heard someone the other day mistakenly say something about, oh, I'm eating Ben and Jerry's, but I don't really like what they believe. I was like, wait, wait, have you actually gone to their website to see all the amazingness that they do for the social causes for their, and they went, and they're like, oh, they didn't know that. They had heard something and then mistakenly thought, oh, but I really shouldn't be eating Ben and Jerry I was like, no, no, no, no, no. Anyways. 


Lesley Logan 34:43  

Everyone, keep eating the Ben and Jerry's. They're, they're, you know, saving the world. 


Hilary Hartling 34:47  

Keep, keep eating the Ben and Jerry's. Yeah, no, I think branding is more necessary than ever. And I will say this too, because I do have clients who come back to me again and again. So there's, you know, one phase of brand strategy. Which is developing your entire brand strategy, and then it's coming back as you're evolving and growing. So I just had a husband and wife couple come back, and I've worked with their two brands separately, and now they're kind of combining into one, and they wanted to come up with who is our niche audience now, because we feel like we've spread ourselves a little too thin. What are our offers? Because we want to be known for the offers we're creating, and we want a signature one too. So that's what I did with them. We said, here's exactly who your audience is, and now because of that, we know exactly what they need. And here is the first thing they need, here's what it's called, here's how we're positioning it, here's how we're pricing it. Here's the promise for what they get. And we did that with three different offers, and they launched within 30 days and made $45,000. So because they got so clear that they understood exactly how to sell it.


Lesley Logan 35:52  

Yeah, can you just say it's almost like you're like, speeding up the process, you know, and it can feel like you're slowing down to take some time to go through this and get the clarity, but also then it just speeds up the process. Because once you're so clear, people know that you're for them or that you're not. 


Hilary Hartling 36:07  

That's right. 


Lesley Logan 36:07  

You know, I heard from another Hilary, who's a dear friend of mine, that, if you've hated in the human design. So right now, like, obviously, if you're into astrology, we're now, you know, in Aquarius and all that stuff, and that's its own unique energy about people. But if you believe in human design, we've been in the generator type of person for a really long time, which is very capitalistic. It's very like, you know. 


Hilary Hartling 36:28  

I'm a generator. 


Lesley Logan 36:29  

Yeah, I'm a generator, too. And I was like, I don't think it's a bad thing. I think we kick ass. But anyways. 


Hilary Hartling 36:33  

No, we work hard. 


Lesley Logan 36:34  

We work hard, we do things. But apparently, like, we're going into a projector type world. And I was interested in that, because one projector that I know, I felt like they just project their shit onto you, and so she's, she's a projector, and she doesn't do that. She actually is able to zero in and like, oh, this is what you're telling me, this is what I'm seeing, and hones it in really well. But what she said is, in a projector world, it becomes not individualistic in that we don't help people. We're not in a community, but that individual brands, individual businesses, are going to be the thing that people are focusing on, wanting to spend their time on. We're seeing this right now as people are like, oh, I'm not. I'm boycotting these brands over here because they don't represent my values. And so then finding smaller businesses who do. And so just the way you just talked about things. And this whole conversation where the world is turning, now more than ever, is the opportunity for all of us to shine, to not be in the shadows of these big brands who are making things either super cheap or were super for the masses, but for like, your individual thing, your idea, can actually work and, and we talked about this in the first episode. You all have to go back and listen to it, but even if you don't have a business, you have a brand, because how people think about you, what they feel when they're with you, all of that stuff is in there. And so I just really adore how you make branding feel like it's like sexy and I want to do it. 


Hilary Hartling 37:55  

I actually think brand, I mean, I'm biased, but I do think branding is sexy, and it's you getting to really choose, right? It's your choice. It's your brand. What do you want to build? What? What do you want to leave your mark as? Right? That it's and it's not just mark as a logo. It's the legacy, it's the impression, it's what lasts, you know, forever. I mean, there's all different kinds of examples of branding and brands and stuff, but what's cool about it is it's meant to be different. So you get to decide how you want to be different and make sure that that's what resonates with your audience. Because it's not all about you either, right? It comes from you. It starts with you. You're defining it, you're shaping it, but you're shaping it for your audience. And so being really clear on that as well, because you said there's so many people who get stuck and stopped there, which is why, why there's been 500,000 ideal client worksheets and, right, identify your target audience and it seems like, okay, I know that, but when people really get down to it, they need to redefine it every time for themselves to say, like, no, this is really who I know I serve. It's just like the two clients who came back to me, you know, they served so many different kinds of people, but they decided, no, who we serve best are coaches, and that's what they went with, right, and being so specific helps the brand become more relevant, more resonant and more compelling for people to understand it, get it and buy it. Yeah.


Lesley Logan 39:25  

Yeah, oh my gosh. Okay, Hilary, well, you know, another amazing conversation with you. We're gonna take a brief break, even though I could talk to you forever and find out where people can find you, follow you, meditate with you. Where do you hang out, Hilary? Where is this meditation? Where can they, like, you know, work with you? 


Hilary Hartling 39:44  

I would say two places. First, my website. So it's hilaryhartling.com H-I-L-A-R-Y-H-A-R-T-L-I-N-G dot com. If you go to the announcement bar on my home page, you click and you download the free meditation. The other places I'm always hanging out is Instagram, and it's the same. It's @HilaryHartling, no spaces, no dots, no nothing. And the meditation is also linked in my bio on Instagram, so you can go grab it for free right now. 


Lesley Logan 40:11  

I think that's beautiful, as are you. Thank you so much. Before I let you go, you've given us a lot to think about, but bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted steps people can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us?


Hilary Hartling 40:23  

Figure out what excites you and follow it. So when you can wake up excited, you are in your flow. When you're in your flow, you not only attract what you want, but you become a magnet for the best people, opportunities and growth. 


Lesley Logan 40:38  

Yeah, yes. Oh my God, that's so succinct and so wonderful and absolutely useful in everything. Ah, guys, how are you gonna use these tips in your life? Share this with a friend who wants to start something. Share this with a friend who has a business. You, you, this could literally be the conversation they need to hear to actually reach the people they want to reach. And Daniel Pink said, if what you do solves a person's problem and takes them out of pain, you have a moral obligation to sell it to them, moral obligation, and the only way that they can hear about you is if you, if you've gone through the things that Hilary is talking about. And so, let her help you. And until next time, Be It Till You See It. 


Lesley Logan 41:15  

That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.


Brad Crowell 41:58  

It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.


Lesley Logan 42:03  

It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.


Brad Crowell 42:07  

Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.


Lesley Logan 42:14  

Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.


Brad Crowell 42:17  

Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.



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