430 Dr. Jordin Wiggins Int
How can women heal from burnout while prioritizing joy and pleasure? In this episode, Dr. Jordin Wiggins, an expert in feminine burnout, shares her experiences with pelvic pain and explains how high-achieving women experience burnout differently. Lesley and Dr. Wiggins explore the science behind burnout, the concept of the 'pleasure tank,' and how to 'microdose' pleasure to rewire your brain for joy. Discover how small, intentional shifts can help you refill your pleasure tank and enhance your overall well-being.
In this episode you will learn about:
- Dr. Wiggins' own experiences with pelvic pain, hormone issues, and anhedonia.
- How women are conditioned to delay pleasure and how this contributes to burnout.
- Why burnout in women is often overlooked, misunderstood, and misdiagnosed.
- The link between anhedonia and the increasing rates of antidepressant prescriptions for women.
- How prioritizing personal pleasure can lead to healthier, more fulfilling relationships.
- Tips for "microdosing" pleasure to rewire your brain and refuel your pleasure tank.
Episode References/Links:
Guest Bio:
Dr. Jordin Wiggins is a Naturopathic Doctor, Author of The Pink Canary, and Pleasure and Intimacy Coach. She is the host of a top ranked global podcast, Pleasure Principals. And she is the CEO of the Pleasure Collective, a coaching community for high achieving women who want more pleasure in their lives, in and out of the bedroom. Combining her 13 years of medical and tantra knowledge with personal experience as domestic and sexual abuse survivor, she is on a mission to reverse the statistic that 1 in 2 women globally suffer from sexual dysfunction. She believes that great sex is just the beginning - everything comes when you learn how to receive: better sex, better health, more wealth.
If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co.
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Episode Transcript:
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 0:00
What we have to do is retrain our brains for pleasure, okay, but hear me, okay, hear me the hear the process. Because at first it's like, okay, this sounds so simple that it can't be true, but when you are experiencing feminine burnout, the pleasure centers in your brain are turned off.
Lesley Logan 0:23
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.
Lesley Logan 1:02
Okay, Be It babe, my overachievers, my peeps who are doing all the things, checking all the boxes and still sometimes wondering why they don't feel awesome. I have an episode for you. In fact, I have a doctor for you. Her name is Dr. Jordin Wiggins and she kind of blew my mind in some way. And it all makes sense. What's so cool is, as soon as she explained it, it all made sense, and I think you're going to really love it. And also, as overachievers, it might be a little bit frustrating, but in a good way, with lots of potential. So we're going to talk joy. We're gonna talk pleasure. We're also going to talk about feminine burnout. And out of the hundreds of episodes that I've done, I've never had anyone explain it like this. And I think this is gonna be one of those episodes you share with a friend and another friend and another friend. So thank you in advance for doing it. Here is Dr. Jordin Wiggins.
Lesley Logan 1:55
All right, Be It, babe. I'm really so excited to have this conversation today with our guest, Dr. Jordin Wiggins, I am going to be honest, like, I read all the things that she is doing amazing things in this world, and I was like, yes, this is a conversation we have to have. And so,. Dr. Jordin Wiggins, will you tell everyone who you are and what you rock at?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 2:12
Yes, thank you so much for having me, Lesley. I am. Dr Jordin Wiggins, I help high-achieving women heal feminine burnout through pleasure.
Lesley Logan 2:25
I mean, that's just so perfect. I mean, everyone who's listening, if you're high-achieving women, raise your hand. That's, that's all of you. Okay, so we but like, have you, like, spent your life avoiding burnout? Have you like, did, what led you, what led you to do it?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 2:40
I had so many episodes of burnout. So we want to go back in high school I started with pelvic pain. And I'll give you a Cole's notes of this, because, like most high-achieving women, I don't do things small scale. I do them big. Right? Like, my wins are big and it's like (inaudible).
Lesley Logan 2:48
You are in great family. I already love you.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 3:01
So high school, pelvic pain. I was a competitive rower doing very, very elite training, but they didn't know it was pelvic pain. So I would get this stabbing pain in between my vagina and my rectum. Can we say? (inaudible) Okay, yeah, I should have asked beforehand.
Lesley Logan 3:25
You don't have to ask.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 3:26
I normally do.
Lesley Logan 3:26
I think we should just say the real words, because, you know, and also, what you're gonna love is that we have a lot of listeners who have boys, and they tell them all the things. They tell them all the things, because they're like, no matter what, no matter who you are in this world, you're gonna be around women. You're gonna work with them. You might be married to them. You might be a parent once, you got to know so you can use all the words.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 3:43
Okay, love, we will use all the vocabulary, and we'll hopefully add to some vocabulary too, because I have my own glossary of terms. Okay. So stabbing pelvic pain would take my breath away, and I am, I am a tough person, not really neurotypical, ADHD, like, I can ignore pain quite easily, forget about it. And this was bad. So I ended up in the ER, a couple times, sent to all different specialists. No one could figure out what it, what the pain was, and they couldn't see it on imaging. Nothing showed in my blood work. So they were basically like, well, this must be in your head. Offered me antidepressants, antipsychotics. And I knew the pain wasn't in my head. I'm not a person that wants to be sick. I don't enjoy being sick, being slowed down by any stretch of the imagination, so I but I felt very let down and very alone during that experience. Fast forward a few more years, when I was doing my pre-med degree, first year, my pre-med degree, went on birth control, and I had my period three weeks out of the month.
Lesley Logan 4:01
Like the opposite of what should happen with birth control.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 4:51
Right. So bleeding for three weeks and not bleeding for one week. So aside from being very iron deficient, depressed, all the things because the solution was, we'll just try a different pill. Just try a different pill. Anyways, all of these times led me to dark places, feeling alone, feeling unsupported, not believed. And my thought was, well, I'm going to become a doctor to help figure this out for women, help solve the problems. Okay? And then when I realized that conventional medicine didn't have the answers that I was seeking because of those experiences, that's when I went into naturopathic medicine. So two degrees, eight years of post-secondary education later, I opened a women's health clinic and loved it, loved it, crushed it, helped so many women, 2000 actually. So did that for 10 years, and hit another burnout, personally. And what was interesting with this one is this one was reflected with my patients at the time. So those first two my pelvic pain and the hormone issues with birth control, I kind of like suffered in silence and was quietly reading research articles, and I felt like something was wrong with me, right? Then, this was a different level. So I'd achieved everything that I wanted to achieve that I set out to achieve. I had my thriving business, I had my house, I had my dream car, and I was not happy. I was like, is this it? There was something so deeply missing and the cognitive dissonance of it. You know, for years, that was my goal, and in so many ways, I was doing it, but not actually feeling happy. So there was that mental part of it, which there is a medical term for it. And I wrote a book about this.
Lesley Logan 7:09
Stop. I call it like an expectation hangover. But what's the medical term?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 7:15
So it's anhedonia, and it's the inability to feel pleasure and joy, and it's one of the diagnostic criteria of major depressive disorder. This is what I was seeing in myself and in my patients. They were being offered antidepressant prescriptions. They're just like, I don't feel like myself. The things that used to make me happy don't make me happy anymore. I don't know what's wrong with me. Something's off. They didn't really have language for it, neither did I, until I, and obviously, the rate of antidepressant prescriptions, which, no pill shaming here, do what you need to do always. But it's just the rate of antidepressant prescriptions. Women are two times more likely to get prescribed an antidepressant than men, and the rate has gone up four or five times since the 90s. So it's like, are we way more depressed? Are we way more depressed than men? Like, what's going on here. But something is. Something's off, and we're feeling off, yeah. So I personally think that anhedonia needs to be treated as its own thing and not be lumped in with major depressive disorder.
Lesley Logan 8:32
Right. Because, I mean, like, what an interesting thing. Even in my own life, I'm doing all the things, right, and you have these moments and you're like, I don't think I'm depressed though. Like, I know that, and so it's and so you almost are afraid to tell your doctor, because you're like, they're going to put me on an antidepressant. I have an amazing doctor that I work with now, and she did ask. She's like, are you depressed? I said, I'm not depressed, but I don't feel like myself. And what I feel like that's almost like the, what you're saying there. Like, what an interesting thing to think about, because, and not to knock it's not like, I don't want to be depressed, like I'm trying to avoid figuring out what it is, but if it isn't depression, if it's this inability to feel pleasure and joy, that's a fascinating thing. So I think a lot of people have that issue, and maybe it's mixed in with depression, but it might actually just be that.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 9:19
Exactly. And I think sometimes it is. It's mixed in with depression. And I've definitely had episodes of major depressive disorder, guaranteed, but there's this looks a little different. It feels a little different. It comes with different physical symptoms as well. So this is what I was noticing in myself. So my hair was falling out. I had adult acne. I wasn't sleeping through the night. I was waking with night sweats, and I was like 20, 29 almost what looked like perimenopausal symptoms, but should not be happening. Crazy, heavy periods. Was gaining weight that was hard to get off. So, yeah, like mood swings, just not myself. Not myself at all. And then my clients were saying the same, coming to me for the same sort of cluster of issues. Yeah, so that's what I now call feminine burnout. And there's the mental, emotional aspect, which is the anhedonia, the mood swings. We're just not as happy as we used to be. It's like, something's off. I'm not like myself. It's really and that's the other piece, is, if we don't have language to put to it, when we are going to our healthcare providers, they're doing their best, and it's like, okay, well, this kind of looks like depression, so that's how we're going to approach treatment. But then I had such a massive patient base, and some of them even tried antidepressants for a time, and they're like, it didn't really work. (inaudible) A lot of them just said, I know I'm not depressed. It's something like this. So we have the mental, emotional stuff, the physical symptoms, and then it was also affecting my patients and myself relationally, like how we were showing up in relationship, so feeling very alone, very unsupported, either things were not great in the bedroom, one way or the other, where some of my patients had literally no desire, no libido, no drive whatsoever. Or they had higher drive, like they were looking for that connection and their part like mismatch libidos, one way or the other. But things were not so great in relationship as well.
Lesley Logan 9:24
And so you're seeing this in your patients. You're seeing this in yourself, and you found this diagnosis, I guess my, I'm gonna tell you my listeners like, okay, tell us what we have to do, though. What is the thing? Do we have to, like, is ita pill? Is it a medication? (inaudible) Is it, do I have to, like, twirl, like, what do we have to do?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 12:16
So this, and this is, I always get the initial eye roll. So go with me on this, but what we have to do is retrain our brains for pleasure, okay, but hear me, okay, hear me, hear the process. Because at first it's like, okay, this sounds so simple that it can't be true. But when you are experiencing feminine burnout, the pleasure centers in your brain are turned off. They've done MRIs like this is a scientific fact. So we are literally focused on survival, fixing to do lists, like crossing items off our to do list feels good. We feel accomplished. Yes, sitting, relaxing, enjoying that's hard to do. So my clients would talk about, I went on vacation and it took me an entire week to relax, or I was out for a walk, or they have their self-care time, but they'll start to, I talk about it. One of my clients gave me this sort of analogy. She's like, it's kind of like old gum that I pick up and chew. If I'm able to relax, or I have time to relax, I'll start to worry about something. Or we'll create a project for ourselves, like a new initiative with work, or start a home reno, the ability to truly be and receive pleasure have a relaxed and regulated nervous system, adrenals that properly respond to stress and aren't just pumping out cortisol all day long. We can't do that when we are experiencing feminine burnout, and nor do we want to because we're focusing on putting out the fires. So the one thing that we should be doing and want to focus on doing that like our body is telling us to resist that, to not do it. Don't focus on it.
Lesley Logan 14:19
Yeah, yeah. It's interesting, because it's like, I guess the next question would be like, and how do we retrain? Because to take that person who feels so safe in a high-stress, almost perfectionist, environment.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 14:31
Addicted to dopamine, to the cortisol.
Lesley Logan 14:35
Do you practice sitting still? Do you like sit still for one minute? Do you eat chocolate?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 14:40
Okay, so this is where we need to do a little bit of pleasure research. And because, like we already talked about, if we're anhedonic, the things that used to make us happy don't make us happy anymore, and our brain is in this simple solution, check the box, move on, kind of thing, which is often like the sex that a lot of my clients describe having, like they're having it to just like, say they did and move on kind of thing. Get it off the to do list and focus on something else. So like, we're not really present with pleasure. We're not really present with connection, but it is what we are so deeply craving at the time, so that's where we have that massive mismatch. So we need to do some research on what makes us feel good, and it's different for every person, and it's probably different for a woman experiencing feminine burnout, you know, if she's going to a Pilates class and doing her meditations, but none of it is landing, like.
Lesley Logan 15:49
Self-care is just not, she's, but it's like that old gum your other clients talk about, yeah.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 15:53
Exactly. It's like, this isn't working, so we need a new approach. So it's twofold. We start to microdose our pleasure. And I say that because the pleasure centers are off, so we need to, just like slowly turn up that dial to get them turned back on. And how I get people to do that is we start by brainstorming a list. So what are things that are going to make you feel good? Is it a bath? Is it sitting in silence? Is it saying no to something? Is it letting somebody, letting your partner, take care of something for you while you relax? It could literally be anything that makes you feel good. But now, again, I'm saying this to you now, and it sounds very simple, and it's like, are you kidding me?
Lesley Logan 16:47
I, you know, here's the thing, I actually know how not simple this is because I had a somatic therapist who was like, I said, I have, I got this space in my day, and I don't really know what to do with it. I don't have a hobby. And she said, just write down everything that could, you think, could feel good. And then when you get to that space in your day, look at the list and just see which one of those things you want to try and you guys, it was so hard because I was like, okay, so I'm gonna go sit down and read a book. And I like, sat there, and I was like, this doesn't feel really good right now. I think I'd rather do this later. And it's just, but you have to be, it's so fucking hard to be patient to figure out what the micro-dose is going to be.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 17:25
Exactly. But I'm so glad that you said that and you tried this, because you can validate it. And that's I literally make my clients put a note on their phone and a pleasure block in their day, whatever they can commit to if it's 10 minutes, 15 minutes. I mean, ideally we've got, like, half an hour, an hour, and it's this time that you would visit the note on your phone and check out what would make me feel good right now. And I call it increasing your pleasure pulse. So 10 out of 10 is fulfilled, abundant. We call it juicy at the pleasure collective, like, you're just like overflowing, you're magnetic, you've your energy, you're like the sun, people want to be around you. It's like warm, or like honey. It's however you want to picture your own higher self-fulfillment. And zero, you're like empty. Pleasure tank is empty. Not happy with yourself, physically like emotionally, just drained. Got nothing, nothing left to give. So if I'm at a two, then my goal becomes, what would make me be a three in my pleasure time? And we're like adding.
Lesley Logan 18:39
I love that. It's like, what when we get a three, not what would get me to 10, you're not going to get to a 10 if you're at a two.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 18:46
Exactly. And then we like to, because, you know, our high-achieving, all or nothing, thinking brains, right? The perfectionist, which is why I'm did the pleasure pulse, because it's like, ladies, we're not getting we're not going to get from a 10 to a two. This is going to take time. And if it was our businesses, or if it was something else, we would totally understand and give it grace. But I did the pleasure pulse so that we can't just be like, well, this is hard, and I'm not a 10, so it didn't work, and just gonna shut down and say that it didn't work, yeah. So note on the phone block in the day, and how am I going to increase my pleasure pulse? What is something that I can do that's going to make me feel good? And yes, sounds simple, but thank you for sharing your experience. Because you think, okay, I'm going to read a book, but you tried the book and you're like, that wasn't it, and it's because we've been conditioned to focus externally, right, on others. We're not focused inward on ourself at all, disconnected from our intuition and the pleasure centers in our brain are off. So it takes time to get them turned back on, and now, in any moment, I can tell you exactly what I want, exactly what would feel good for me right now, but it took time and practice to hone that skill. And if I'm not doing my pleasure practices and I, you know, life, life happens. Like to think that we can be at a 10 all day, every day, unrealistic. So if life happens and I am a two or I am a four, then, like, it's, it's even harder for me, like I have to work harder at it, right? Because neurologically, neurochemically, I'm in survival. I'm in nervous system dysregulation, so it's harder to know what to do to feel good.
Lesley Logan 20:50
Right. Hopefully you start to notice when you go from a 10 to a five before you get to a two, hopefully. But also, you know, I heard this interesting thing, because the Olympics are on while we're recording this. And this one person in Olympics said, like, if when you're going for a goal, it always feels good, it's always achievable, your goal isn't big enough. It should also not be that every day is a bad day. So it shouldn't be like, so hard every day to achieve your goal. And he also said, 1/3 of the day should be good, 1/3 of the days you should feel like you're making progress, it's awesome, 1/3 of the day should just feel like it was achievable, not like, meh, you know, like, whelmed, right? Like, this right there, there's nothing wrong. It's not bad, it's not good, it's just even. And then 1/3 of the day are gonna feel really hard. And so the goal is to just man it, make sure that you're in balance there and you're not tipping too far in one direction. And I think what's hard for most people is they notice the one day that they're going down and like, oh, and they excuse it. I have this so much stuff going on. I just gotta win. This happens all and then by the time that they actually acknowledge that they've gone down, they're back to a two, and that's when it's so hard to get back up, because they're going to try to go back to that 10, doing the things they're doing at a 10. But like you said, you're dysregulated, so you have to actually do something really small again. You have to go back to the 10 thing.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 22:09
I love it. It's, yeah, exactly those. And that's why that concept of micro-dosing, you know, how do I just feel a little better, little better, and I'm working with my clients, training them to know, okay, I took a hit today or the last couple days. I'm a five. What am I going to need to do to get back up and recognizing it? What are those warning signs to see it coming, so that we know before we're at the two.
Lesley Logan 22:09
Yeah, yeah. So I want it like, I think this is really fascinating. So now that you you saw this in your clients, you saw this in your patients, you saw it in yourself. You did some research, you started to like, experience and explore, and now you've got what you're teaching. How has that been like, even received among the women you're trying to help? And what are some things that you're seeing? Like, either push back on from people, or maybe they're just thinking, like, it's too easy. I like, it should be hard. I should have the pill. I'm missing this hormone. Like, what are you seeing?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 23:10
I do get a lot of people that are like, it's, I think it's, I think it's my hormones. I think I have a hormone imbalance. Like, there's, there's wanting to explain it away to be one thing, right, that one box to check, especially when our brain is in that mode. And that's why, because I was trained, and I did so much continuing education, I was flying everywhere to learn how to treat what I didn't know was feminine burnout, and yes, there is a component of hormone imbalance. Yes, there is a component of adrenal dysfunction, or if we have been stressed for a really long time, then we can have digestive issues. Like there's it is compounded and it is layered. However, if we are at a five plus, like if our nervous systems are, for the most part, regulated, if we can mount a good stress response, if we're not inflamed, then we have that resiliency to handle what life throws at us without having a hormone imbalance. So to me, hormones, a lot of the time, are a lag indicator. It's an indicator that you were experiencing feminine burnout. There was other things happening well before you got to the point of hormone imbalance.
Lesley Logan 24:40
I think that's also, probably the stomach issues as well, there's those kinds of things. They're like, okay, fine, you're not going to help me here. Now, we're over here, so it's almost like there was a yellow light slow down, and we didn't listen until it was the red. And then it's a bigger a bigger fish to fry, because you've got to do, you still have, it sounds like you can take care of the hormones, you could take care of the gut, but you still have to figure out the pleasure. You still have that.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 25:05
And that's exactly what I was finding. And what I didn't like about what I was doing and the treatment plans and the protocols that I was giving is women were feeling better. The digestive issues was better, the hormone issues were better, but they had to be very regimented about what they were doing, and it was so easy for them to fall back, to get back to that too. And I mean, again, I'm talking about pleasure. It's all about pleasure to be to have to be so restrictive on a diet, to digest well and to feel light and like
Lesley Logan 25:06
There's no joy in that. No. There's no pleasure. No.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 25:27
No, you're and it was like, I'm not, I'm missing something. I'm not really getting to the root here, because we need to be so careful, or the hormones needed to be tweaked, or their thyroid medication needed to be tweaked, and it's just like what was I missing?
Lesley Logan 26:08
Yeah. So, okay, so because I think the overachievers in the room have not felt pleasure in a long time, can you explain even, like, just idea why? What are different forms of enjoying pleasure or feeling joy? Like, just in case they're like, okay, I've heard the word, but if we ask them today, like, what would make them feel joy? But obviously they're gonna have, like, very few things, or they're gonna think it should be like, time with their kids or sitting at a beach or something like that. So what are, what are just some list examples that could help people find pleasure and joy. What are some things that they could do?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 26:44
Yes, and I want to say because if people are new to my work, sometimes even the word pleasure feels like repulsive or jarring.
Lesley Logan 26:52
I think it's like not even repulsive for jarring. It almost feels like selfish. I have so much to do. The dishes have to get done. The laundry has to get done. How dare I sit down and do a puzzle to feel joy right now? Or this dessert is amazing, but I gotta clean before bed. I gotta get to bed so I'm not gonna sit and enjoy the pleasure of the bite of ice cream.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 27:15
It's part of our conditioning, right? Do first, pleasures last. Work hard, then play hard. That's how we've been conditioned, and that's what creates the recipe for feminine burnout. Is that we feel like feeling good should come last, but there's always so much to do that we never get to the feeling good part. So really, it's about flipping it, putting pleasure first, and you are more efficient. And when you ask people to do things for you, and you are, you know, a five or an eight, it's when you have more of that attractive energy. When you're at a zero and you are asking somebody for help with something for the dishes that need to get done so that you can do a puzzle or read it's just a, it comes out sideways, you know, when we are so burnt out. And then that's also where women get pissed, where, okay, I'm doing so much, and now you're telling me I have to do more, because it's frustrating, right? So you're telling me that I have to work on myself. Or do, you know, I call it plugging the holes in our pleasure tank, because the pleasure, what we're pouring in, the things that we're doing to feel good, that's one part of it. But if our container, our system, I call it a pleasure tank, just for the visual, has holes poked in it, we could self-care all day long and still not feel fulfilled. We're still not raising.
Lesley Logan 28:50
Right, right, because you're pouring it's all just, it's going out through one of the holes. Yeah. I got it.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 28:54
Exactly, exactly. So the list of the pleasure things, and we can, let me tell you that, but that that's the one piece, and then the part that's like, the harder work to do is, how do we plug the holes and make sure that we can maintain, you know, I like to say a seven, so that we've got that resiliency. Because life's going to happen and we're going to things are going to be hard sometimes, but then at least if we're dropping, we're dropping to a five and not a two. So pleasure, and I like to look at it in two ways, because we have that sort of negative connotation to it. We think it's about sex or bedroom. And yes, that is part of it. But there's also just, like, look at kids, how happy they are, how joyful they are. Life is amazing. Little things are amazing and awe-inspiring. And it's about finding that wonder and play and things that feel good outside as well. So calling a friend you. Now also this is, this is where it gets deep, right? Because if you are an overachiever, you're probably overachieving in your friendships too, and you're probably the one that people go to with the problems. So you're probably get, calling a friend that helps fill your tank that you feel great after talking to them, not that you've just given them a therapy session and all these suggestions on how to run their business.
Lesley Logan 29:23
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And don't, don't call the aunt who's negative all the time. Like it sounds like a little breaking system has to happen. And then you call the, you can call a friend who like fills your cup.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 30:40
Yeah, exactly. So you're writing in the note in your phone, like, call X, like the friend that fills your cup up. Yeah, movement. So people, again, we're starting small, but I love if people would enroll themselves in some type of movement class, like, some type of dance yoga is amazing. Pilates is amazing. We know this, getting a massage is amazing. But some type of dance class, or feminine movement class, like pole dancing a heels class, which is also way, like, I have clients that do it, and they're in our group chat, they're like, oh my god. I can't believe I just did that. Like, it's a very out of their comfort zone.
Lesley Logan 31:25
Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna get a pole in the house, because, to be honest, the pole classes in Vegas are always at night, and I'm like, I'm in bed at eight o'clock, ladies, I need a four o'clock pole class. That's what I want. So, but it is super fun. You have it. It's a different kind of dopamine high. It's so fun. And then there and the heels classes, like, just like having a practice walking in those heels, you become it's a different kind of be it till you see it. I'll tell you, it's a be it till you see it for pleasure. Those kinds of classes, yes.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 31:50
Yes. I have a pole in my house. So there you go, get grab one in yours. There's even great free online. There's so much free online, like beginner poles, to have it in your house, but you know, I'm personally the special kind of person, like I need to be held accountable to the class. I'm better at using my but sometimes, if I'm in burnout, I will go months without touching my pole at home. But if I sign up for a class, I will show up every time because I did.
Lesley Logan 31:51
Yeah, yeah, yeah. If, I mean, it's a good reminder. Like, if you know that you're going down to a five on this pleasure pulse, maybe sign up for things that hold you accountable to get you back up to that seven so that you can do it on your own time. But yeah, it's okay to need accountability.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 32:36
Yeah, for sure. I'm totally a need accountability kind of person. So there's the like, the stuff, you know, reading, bath, things that are going to make us feel good, slow us down. There's movement, which I highly recommend, some type of feminine movement class, dance class. And if that's too much, then anything yoga, Pilates, but not boot camp style, right? Like, generally, we're doing too much when we are experiencing burnout, because to build muscle is an inflammatory process, and if you have feminine burnout, you are already very inflamed. And that's why a lot of women are like, why can't I lose weight? I'm more, I'm doing boot camps five days a week.
Lesley Logan 33:21
Well, zone two, ladies, come on. Zone two. You know if you're listening to us and you're over 40. You don't even need to do 40-minute workouts, actually. So.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 33:29
Yes, thank you.
Lesley Logan 33:32
I leave class early. It's okay. They're not gonna say anything. Show up on time. Leave early. Take care of yourself. But it's very interesting all the research that's out there for perimenopause and post menopause to keep your cortisol down, you should be doing under 40-minute workouts.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 33:48
Thank you. Like I'd say that on repeat, it's just so good, too.
Lesley Logan 33:57
Yeah. But I love that. I think that these are some really good things that people can, like, there might even be, and if we listen, if she said anything that you're already doing, then maybe notice, like, are you doing too much, or are you needing to put on some music while you're doing? Like, is there something else you can change with it? Because, as the overachievers listening there probably are going to class seven days a week, maybe we actually need to (inaudible).
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 34:19
(inaudible) doing less. And what else doing less, and then asking yourself, How can I make this moment more pleasurable?
Lesley Logan 34:27
Yes, oh, I love that question. That question is so good.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 34:30
If you're stuck, that's what you're asking yourself. And is it, you know, do I need flesh fresh flowers on my desk? Do I need to light a candle and put music on while I'm making dinner. What little tweaks, little micro-doses can we do to feel better? And then obviously, there is the physical stuff as well. Like more, you know, when you think of pleasure, what you would think of so, massages, self-pleasure, reading an erotic novel, like things like that. The more spicy types of pleasure.
Lesley Logan 35:06
There's like a whole new uptick in the romance novel world like that is that, that genre of books is like having, it's a new resurgence, and it's kind of, it's quite amazing. So I love, I think that's I love these. I think it's great. So if you're going to class seven days a week and you're having this feminine burnout, take one of those classes off and try self-pleasure stuff.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 35:07
Reading erotic novel.
Lesley Logan 35:11
Yeah, yeah. I think this is really exciting stuff, and we could talk about it forever, and obviously you're like, the expert at it. We're going to take a brief break, and then we're gonna find out how people can find you, follow you, work with you.
Lesley Logan 35:40
All right. Dr. Jordin Wiggins, this has been awesome. I think you may have just helped a lot of listeners go, hmm, I wonder if this is feminine burnout and not just my hormones and stress and all these things. I think that there's a lot of pondering going on. Where can people find you, follow you work with you?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 35:57
Find me on Instagram @DrJordinWiggins, my podcast, The Pleasure Principles podcast is another great place. If you are pondering and you're like, is this me? There's a ton of amazing information there. And if you want to work with me, send me a DM on Instagram.
Lesley Logan 36:15
Perfect. Love that it's so easy as it should be, we're in there in front of burnout, so it should be easy.
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 36:20
Yeah. Oh, trust me, simple, more, the simpler the better.
Lesley Logan 36:24
All right, you actually have given us some great tips already. But just in case anyone missed it, they skipped to the end, bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted steps people can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us?
Dr. Jordin Wiggins 36:34
Ask yourself, how can I make this moment more pleasurable? If you can ask yourself that multiple times a day, I guarantee you you will be increasing your pleasure pulse. And the second thing is, make a note in your phone of things that you can do to help micro-dose your pleasure. What is going to make you feel a little bit better, so that when you have downtime, ideally, it's scheduled downtime, scheduled pleasure breaks in your day. You're going to look at that note in your phone and you're going to do something that helps increase your pleasure pulse, helps turn on the pleasure centers in your brain.
Lesley Logan 37:18
Those are good. Those are good. I love, I love a good question. We have Gay Hendricks on the, on our 400th episode, and he has, he likes to go, hmm, I wonder, because the brain loves a hmm, and a I wonder. And I love that your question's like, I wonder, how can I make this more pleasurable? What a great thing. You guys, it's such a, it's, you'd be surprised, you know, like, I don't like to do, I like to clean the house, and so when I do, I'm like, what's a podcast that would be really fun to listen to, not stressful, because I'm doing something I don't want to do. Or, like, if it's, if Brad's awake, I can turn on some music and I can play something, or sometimes I throw on an Abraham Hicks, like, Morning Rampage, you know. So I think this is a really fun, easy thing that we can do just to start to enjoy the pleasurable moments in our lives. And you know, wow, great stuff. Dr Wiggins, you are so amazing. Thank you so much. You guys, how are you doing these tips in your life? Make sure you tag. Dr Jordin Wiggins. Tag the Be It Pod. Share this with us. Share this episode with a friend who needs it. I bet you probably, as you were thinking through, you might be thinking, oh, my friend, like, share this with them, because what an interesting thing when we can actually go, oh, it's not just my stomach and my hormones and these things. It could be those things. It also could be that they have feminine burnout, and they could actually take Jordin's words and enjoy more joy and pleasure and get the help that they need. Until next time, Be It Till You See It.
Lesley Logan 38:40
That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.
Brad Crowell 39:23
It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.
Lesley Logan 39:28
It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.
Brad Crowell 39:32
Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.
Lesley Logan 39:39
Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.
Brad Crowell 39:43
Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.
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